India’s strength has always been its vibrant democracy. But the imposition of Emergency in 1975 struck at the very core of their ideal. It was perhaps the darkest period in the history of Independent India. Those who lived through Indira Gandhi’s Emergency shudder at what they underwent during the tumultuous times when democracy was trampled as the country virtually became a dictatorship, ironically under a woman whose father Jawaharlal Nehru laid the foundations of that democratic system.
Among those who witnessed those times closely was Mohan Dharia who was imprisoned for 17 months in Nashik jail during the Emergency and proudly says he was the only minister to resign from Indira Gandhi’s government in 1975, to protest against her policies.
Dharia, is now president of Vanarai, a trust focusing on integrated rural development.
Excerpts from the interview
India will be celeb rating 64th Independence Day. Looking back what do you think are the problems plaguing the country
One of the biggest problem facing the country is corruption and black money. Since the last 15 years I have been writing to different successive governments to take effective measures to check proliferation of black money. But unfortunately none has been serious in tackling this issue. Another big problem before the country is that we have government but there is no administration. The bureaucracy does not care a hoot about the government. This is because while preparing the constitution we have given protection to the bureaucracy. The blunder was made by the then Prime minister Jawaharlal Nehru who refused to sideline those bureaucrats who opposed the Freedom Struggle during the pre independence day. What is happening today is that those who had opposed the freedom struggle continued as government servants and they are getting pensions.
What measures have you suggested to the government to curb black money?
I have written to different finance ministers asking them to enact a law asking all those High Networth Individuals who have stashed up unaccounted money in India and abroad be given a specific timeframe to declare their assets. Once this is done the same can be converted into white money by asking them to pay appropriate fine. Those who fail do so should be declared as criminals and all their properties should be confiscated by the government. Secondly the government should form a good network of informers to gather information about the tax evaders and they should be given good rewards for giving information about them and their works should be recognized as a service to the nation. Thirdly during the Income Tax raids, the officials should be asked to take video clippings of the seized unaccounted wealth in the presence of two witnesses. Besides no officer of the Income Tax department should have the power to compound the offence of tax evasion. If this system is followed I am sure crores and crores of unaccounted money will come out. But none of the governments have bothered to put this suggestion into practice.
Why do you think that the government is reluctant to act on it?
The answer is simple. There hands are not clean. They are more keen to protect the tax evaders than prosecute them.
It seems your thoughts are in line with that of anti- corruption leader Anna Hazare and Yoga guru Ramdeo Baba. Why have you then remained a mute spectator instead of voicing what you think on the issue of corruption and black money when the whole nation is debating this issue?
I sharply disagree with the methods of Anna Hazare and Ramdeo Baba. I also feel the government bungled in dealing with these two people. Firstly just having a Lok Pal bill is not going to solve all the problems. Today there are laws banning child marriages. But on an auspicious Day 10,000 marriages are celebrated in Rajasthan in which most of them are minors in which the chief minister himself presides over. Despite having clear laws which bans child marriage there are flagrant violations. So let us not live in the fools paradise that having a strong Lokpal is going to be the panacea for all the evils.
So how do you see the spat that is going on among the Government, Anna Hazare and Ramdeo Baba on the issue of Lokpal Bill?
Firstly it was wrong on the part of Anna Hazare to blackmail the government by undertaking fast unto death. Mahatma Gandhi had resorted to indefinite fast to protest against the Britishers but resorting to such a means against Indian government is not acceptable. Secondly it was wrong on the part of the government to allow ministers to sit with the members of Civil Society to draft the Lokpal bill. There is no harm if Anna Hazare or his so-called society gives the draft of the bill. But the government should not have buckled to form the joint committee. Even if the bill is prepared as per the wishes and dictates of Anna Hazare it has to come before the joint parliamentary committee for approval. They have every right to elicit the views of the public. In the case of Ramdeo Baba there was no need for the government to send four ministers at the airport to meet him and then when it failed, break their agitation in the middle of night through force. It only created sympathy for him and animosity for the government.
Do you think the Prime Minister should come under the ambit of Lokpal Bill?
The Prime Minister himself has clarified that he has no opposition to him being under the ambit of Lokpal Bill. He has only said that Chief Justice should not be there. Those whose hands are clean have no reason to worry about Lokpal or any other institution.
You were sent to jail because you had opposed Indira Gandhi’s policies and Emergency. But today many political leaders like A Raja , Suresh Kalmadi and Kannimozi are cooling their heels in jails on corruption charges. What is your take on them.
It is sad to see these leaders going to jail on corruption charges. Power through money and money through power is a chain which is the bane in todays politics. I was in charge of several ministries. I am glad that I had an unblemished tenure.
You have been observing the Congress party since its inception. Where do you see it going?
Now there is no intra party democracy. What Sonia decides is the rule of the day. There is none in the Congress who can defy her. Same was the position when Indira Gandhi was at the helm of the country. In those days there used to be a saying that there is only one “man” in the whole of Parliament. And that was Indira and the rest were all females. I happened to be the only person who opposed Indira and had to pay a price by going to jail. But I am happy to be what I am.
With several corrupt politicians at the helm of affairs how do you see the future of India ?
When Emergency was declared by Indira Gandhi, it was difficult to believe that one could overthrow the regime of Indira Gandhi. But people did precisely that. I have full faith in the people of India and especially the younger generation who are vehemently opposed to corruption. I am optimistic that our country will regain its full glory.
People generally start with social work and then use it as a gateway to enter politics. But you were basically a politician who has completely shifted to social and environmental work. How was the transition?
I am very much inspired by the thoughts of Mahatma Gandhi. I am aware that just industrialization and economic growth are not enough. What is needed is overall development of human being. In this context reverse migration from the cities to the villages could play a vital role for overall growth, progress and prosperity of the country. The programme of reverse migration has a potential to enrich our villages and save our unplanned ugly cities. Hence social and environmental work is more important to me.
